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Debating Federal Health Care Policy

Renee Shaw and her guests discuss the Affordable Care Act and the American Health Care Act. Guests: Dr. Barbara Casper, an internist and professor of medicine at the University of Louisville; Dr. Cameron Schaeffer, a pediatric urologist; Dustin Pugel, researcher at the Kentucky Center for Economic Policy; and Jim Waters, president of the Bluegrass Institute for Public Policy Solutions.
Season 24 Episode 21 Length 56:33 Premiere: 06/12/17

About

Kentucky Tonight

KET’s Kentucky Tonight, hosted by Renee Shaw, brings together an expert panel for in-depth analysis of major issues facing the Commonwealth.

This weekly program features comprehensive discussions with lawmakers, stakeholders and policy leaders that are moderated by award-winning journalist Renee Shaw.

For nearly three decades, Kentucky Tonight has been a source for complete and balanced coverage of the most urgent and important public affairs developments in the state of Kentucky.

Often aired live, viewers are encouraged to participate by submitting questions in real-time via email, Twitter or KET’s online form. Viewers with questions and comments may send an email to kytonight@ket.org or use the contact form. All messages should include first and last name and town or county. The phone number for viewer calls during the program is 800-494-7605.

After the broadcast, Kentucky Tonight programs are available on KET.org and via podcast (iTunes or Android). Files are normally accessible within 24 hours after the television broadcast.

Kentucky Tonight was awarded a 1997 regional Emmy by the Ohio Valley Chapter of the National Academy of Television Arts and Sciences. The series was also honored with a 1995 regional Emmy nomination.

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Call 800-945-9167 or email shop@ket.org.


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The Kentucky Tonight podcast features each episode’s audio for listening.


Renee Shaw is the Director of Public Affairs and Moderator at KET, currently serving as host of KET’s weeknight public affairs program Kentucky Edition, the signature public policy discussion series Kentucky Tonight, the weekly interview series Connections, Election coverage and KET Forums.

Since 2001, Renee has been the producing force behind KET’s legislative coverage that has been recognized by the Kentucky Associated Press and the National Educational Telecommunications Association. Under her leadership, KET has expanded its portfolio of public affairs content to include a daily news and information program, Kentucky Supreme Court coverage, townhall-style forums, and multi-platform program initiatives around issues such as opioid addiction and youth mental health.  

Renee has also earned top awards from the Ohio Valley Chapter of the National Academy of Television Arts and Sciences (NATAS), with three regional Emmy awards. In 2023, she was inducted into the Silver Circle of the NATAS, one of the industry’s highest honors recognizing television professionals with distinguished service in broadcast journalism for 25 years or more.  

Already an inductee into the Kentucky Civil Rights Hall of Fame (2017), Renee expands her hall of fame status with induction into Western Kentucky University’s Hall of Distinguished Alumni in November of 2023.  

In February of 2023, Renee graced the front cover of Kentucky Living magazine with a centerfold story on her 25 years of service at KET and even longer commitment to public media journalism. 

In addition to honors from various educational, civic, and community organizations, Renee has earned top honors from the Associated Press and has twice been recognized by Mental Health America for her years-long dedication to examining issues of mental health and opioid addiction.  

In 2022, she was honored with Women Leading Kentucky’s Governor Martha Layne Collins Leadership Award recognizing her trailblazing path and inspiring dedication to elevating important issues across Kentucky.   

In 2018, she co-produced and moderated a 6-part series on youth mental health that was awarded first place in educational content by NETA, the National Educational Telecommunications Association. 

She has been honored by the AKA Beta Gamma Omega Chapter with a Coretta Scott King Spirit of Ivy Award; earned the state media award from the Kentucky Society of the Daughters of the American Revolution in 2019; named a Charles W. Anderson Laureate by the Kentucky Personnel Cabinet in 2019 honoring her significant contributions in addressing socio-economic issues; and was recognized as a “Kentucky Trailblazer” by the University of Kentucky Martin School of Public Policy and Administration during the Wendell H. Ford Lecture Series in 2019. That same year, Shaw was named by The Kentucky Gazette’s inaugural recognition of the 50 most notable women in Kentucky politics and government.  

Renee was bestowed the 2021 Berea College Service Award and was named “Unapologetic Woman of the Year” in 2021 by the Community Action Council.   

In 2015, she received the Green Dot Award for her coverage of domestic violence, sexual assault & human trafficking. In 2014, Renee was awarded the Anthony Lewis Media Award from the KY Department of Public Advocacy for her work on criminal justice reform. Two Kentucky governors, Republican Ernie Fletcher and Democrat Andy Beshear, have commissioned Renee as a Kentucky Colonel for noteworthy accomplishments and service to community, state, and nation.  

A former adjunct media writing professor at Georgetown College, Renee traveled to Cambodia in 2003 to help train emerging journalists on reporting on critical health issues as part of an exchange program at Western Kentucky University. And, she has enterprised stories for national media outlets, the PBS NewsHour and Public News Service.  

Shaw is a 2007 graduate of Leadership Kentucky, a board member of CASA of Lexington, and a longtime member of the Frankfort/Lexington Chapter of The Links Incorporated, an international, not-for-profit organization of women of color committed to volunteer service. She has served on the boards of the Kentucky Historical Society, Lexington Minority Business Expo, and the Board of Governors for the Ohio Valley Chapter of the National Academy of Television Arts and Sciences. 

Host Renee Shaw smiling in a green dress with a KET set behind her.

Debating the Best Health Care System for Kentucky

GOP leaders in the U.S. Senate want to pass a health care bill by the end of June. But so far, few specific details have emerged on just how the Senate may change the version of the American Health Care Act passed by the U.S. House of Representatives in May.

With just a handful of legislative days left on this month’s calendar, that leaves little time for a full and open debate on the provisions of the Senate’s proposal.

KET’s Kentucky Tonight explored the health care policy proposals and some of the challenges in the current system. The guests were Dr. Barbara Casper, an internist and professor of medicine at the University of Louisville; Dustin Pugel, research and policy associate at the Kentucky Center for Economic Policy; Dr. Cameron Schaeffer, a pediatric urologist with offices in Lexington and Louisville; and Jim Waters, president and CEO of the Bluegrass Institute for Public Policy Solutions.
 

 
Provisions of the AHCA
A key goal of the GOP’s American Health Care Act (AHCA) is to repeal and replace the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (ACA or Obamacare) that President Barack Obama signed into law in 2010. The House version of the AHCA includes provisions to restructure Medicaid funding and roll back the expansion of Medicaid coverage allowed in the ACA.

The new bill also replaces Obamacare’s income-based tax credits and subsidies with age-based credits, eliminates the penalty on individuals who don’t get insurance, funds high-risk pools for people with expensive pre-existing conditions, and makes it easier for insurance companies to charge more to older and sicker individuals.

The Congressional Budget Office score of the AHCA, which came out after the House vote, said the legislation would reduce the federal deficit by $119 billion over the next decade, but also leave 23 million more Americans without insurance. Impacts to premium payments will depend largely on the age of the individual and the state in which they reside: Younger people could see little change or even a decrease in their monthly premiums, while older Americans could experience a huge jump in their insurance costs.

Critiquing the Proposed Reforms
Even without any details about what the Senate may tweak in the AHCA, the legislation has managed to anger those on the left and the right.

“At its core this bill is about massive tax cuts, mainly for the wealthy, at the expense of people on Medicaid,” says Dustin Pugel of the Kentucky Center for Economic Policy. “I think that there are ways that we can and should improve on the ACA, but to pass AHCA, to radically change the way we pay for traditional Medicaid [and] to completely end coverage for people on the expansion would be a catastrophe.”

In addition to potentially hurting the 470,000 Kentuckians who acquired coverage through the ACA’s Medicaid expansion, Pugel says lower-income individuals buying insurance through the exchange could also be affected. He contends the age-based structure for the subsidies will be much less generous, and that could leave some people unable to afford any coverage at all.

Jim Waters of the Bluegrass Institute for Public Policy Solutions says one positive aspect of the AHCA is that it gives states more flexibility to manage health care dollars. Otherwise, he calls the AHCA a “repeal in name only” since it keeps many Obamacare provisions, including the subsidies.

“The problem is Congress basically is going to wash its hands of the mess that’s been made,” says Waters. “We think this bill says, go ahead states, do your thing and we’ll keep the subsidies flowing.”

Even doctors are split on the relative benefits of Obamacare and its proposed replacement.

“I’ve had a problem with Obamacare not only as a doctor but as an American,” says Dr. Cameron Schaeffer. “This country was founded on principles of individualism, liberty, freedom … and Obamacare in my mind was the last nail of deconstructing our constitution.”

Schaeffer acknowledges that more people now have insurance, but he contends the improved health outcomes and economic gains promised under the ACA have not materialized. Plus he says Obamacare and the Medicaid expansion have saddled the country and future generations with an “immoral” amount of debt.

Among the low-income patients she sees, Dr. Barbara Casper says the ACA made dramatic improvements for those who were able to finally get insurance coverage. She says they are now receiving regular check-ups and preventive care rather than simply visiting an emergency room when a crisis strikes. Casper fears the AHCA would result in many of her patients losing health insurance they’re now used to having.

“Government is best when we protect the most vulnerable among us,” Casper says.” “People don’t get sick on purpose, it happens to them, it can be a catastrophic illness and to penalize those folks and not allow a safety net for them to actually get the care they need without going bankrupt is really unconscionable.”

The Fate of Medicaid
Another problem with Obamacare, says Waters, is that he says it took a sledgehammer to existing problems in the health care system, including how to deal with uninsured populations. For example, expanding Medicaid to those at 138 percent of the federal poverty level (that equates to an annual income of about $16,000 for an individual) did give more people coverage. But Waters contends they still can’t get care because of a long-standing issue of too few doctors willing to take Medicaid patients.

“My question is, if we already had an issue with access problem before Obamacare, which we did with Medicaid, how is adding 400,000 new enrollees to that program going to really address that problem?” Waters says.

Casper says it makes no sense to throw people off Medicaid if they only go back to seeking care at emergency rooms. She says that simply shifts the cost burden to those facilities that must provide uncompensated care, and it’s a poor way for low-income people to manage chronic health conditions. Schaeffer says he’s concerned about fraud in the Medicaid system, and that Kentucky can’t afford its Medicaid expansion given the unfunded liabilities in the state’s public pension plans.

The AHCA proposes converting Medicaid funds to a block grant in which the federal government would provide states a fixed amount of money for their Medicaid programs regardless of how many enrollees they have. Waters says that would give states more flexibility to tailor their Medicaid programs to the specific health needs of their citizens. But Pugel fears it will result in Kentuckians losing Medicaid coverage, and also result in the end of thousands of health care jobs that the expansion has helped to create.

“This doesn’t give Kentucky flexibility. This hamstrings us,” Pugel says. “It forces the state to decide who’s going to get care – is it going to be kids, is it going to be seniors, is it going to be people with disabilities.”

Even before Congress proposed Medicaid changes in the AHCA, Gov. Matt Bevin applied to federal regulators to overhaul Kentucky’s program by adding work requirements and small premiums and co-pays for enrollees. Casper says many of the working poor on Medicaid are already juggling multiple jobs. Plus she says many of them also have no checking accounts or credit cards, which would make keeping up with monthly premiums difficult. Finally she says the administrative costs of collecting those payments would far exceed what the state would collect.

Containing Costs
The Kentucky Tonight panel members agree on one thing: that more transparency in the health care system could promote lower costs. They say doctors and health care facilities should publicize what they charge so that consumers can make more informed choices about their care. Schaeffer adds that patients would also have more incentive to pressure the system to lower health care costs if they had to pay more out of pocket for those services.

Cost transparency must also be coupled with more data about the quality of care being provided, according to the panel. Casper contends that one flaw in the current system is that it’s too focused on the services rendered or the procedures performed.

“The problem is that insurance pays for volume and not quality,” says Casper. “That’s something that needs to be changed in the system to decrease costs.”

Another cost driver, according to Waters and Schaeffer, is forcing people, especially younger enrollees, to purchase more coverage than they may need. They contend the theory of spreading costs among younger, healthier people and older, sicker people doesn’t work well in reality.

“Risk sharing makes sense if the policies sold to young people can be afforded,” says Schaeffer. “But when you mandate coverage for things that people don’t need, that raises the price and [it] becomes untenable for people.”

Waters adds that the overall system needs to be more innovative to allow people to obtain coverage that is more individualized and portable. He also argues that insurance policies have evolved away from the original intent, which was covering catastrophic events that people wouldn’t be able to afford, to the current system of covering a broad range of preventive and health maintenance services.

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Connections host Renee Shaw smiling in a gray suit along with the show logo and a "Check Schedule" button.Connections host Renee Shaw smiling in a gray suit along with the show logo and a "Check Schedule" button.

Season 24 Episodes

Economic Impact of Pension Changes

S24 E35 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 10/30/17

Public Pension Reform Proposal

S24 E34 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 10/23/17

Transportation Issues

S24 E33 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 10/16/17

Tax Policy: An Ongoing Debate

S24 E32 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 10/09/17

Debating Immigration Issues

S24 E31 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 10/02/17

Special Session on Pensions

S24 E30 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 09/11/17

Tort Law

S24 E29 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 08/28/17

More Debate on Public Pensions

S24 E28 Length 56:35 Premiere Date 08/14/17

More State Tax Reform Debate

S24 E27 Length 56:34 Premiere Date 07/31/17

U.S. Foreign Policy

S24 E26 Length 56:34 Premiere Date 07/24/17

National and State Politics

S24 E25 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 07/17/17

Workers' Compensation

S24 E24 Length 56:34 Premiere Date 07/10/17

State Tax Reform

S24 E23 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 06/26/17

School Choice and Tax-Credit Scholarships

S24 E22 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 06/19/17

Debating Federal Health Care Policy

S24 E21 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 06/12/17

Public Employee Pensions

S24 E20 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 06/07/17

Energy Policy in Kentucky

S24 E19 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 05/22/17

Prospects for Tax Reform

S24 E18 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 05/08/17

Trump's First 100 Days

S24 E17 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 05/03/17

Current Foreign Policy Issues

S24 E16 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 04/17/17

General Assembly Recap

S24 E15 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 04/12/17

Changes in Health Care Policy

S24 E14 Length 56:38 Premiere Date 03/27/17

2017 New Legislation

S24 E13 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 03/20/17

Issues from the General Assembly

S24 E12 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 02/27/17

Criminal Justice Legislation

S24 E11 Length 56:34 Premiere Date 02/20/17

Debating Medical Review Panels

S24 E10 Length 56:34 Premiere Date 02/06/17

Future of Affordable Care Act

S24 E9 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 01/30/17

K-12 Education

S24 E8 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 01/23/17

New Legislation in the 2017 General Assembly

S24 E7 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 01/09/17

Future of Political Parties

S24 E5 Length 55:43 Premiere Date 12/12/16

Debating Charter Schools

S24 E4 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 12/05/16

Debating State Tax Reform

S24 E3 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 11/21/16

Election 2016 Postmortem

S24 E2 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 11/14/16

Political Trends in the 2016 Election

S24 E1 Length 56:33 Premiere Date 11/07/16

See All Episodes

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Legislative Session Recap - S31 E2

Renee Shaw and guests recap the 2024 legislative session. Scheduled guests: Morgan Eaves, executive director of the Kentucky Democratic Party; Tres Watson, Republican political strategist and founder Capitol Reins PR; Abby Piper, founder and managing partner of Piper | Smith LLC, a government and public relations firm; and Jared Smith, a Democratic strategist and partner at Piper | Smith LLC. A 2024 KET production.

  • Tuesday April 16, 2024 1:00 pm ET on KETKY
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Kentucky Tonight - S31 E3

  • Monday April 22, 2024 8:00 pm ET on KET
  • Monday April 22, 2024 7:00 pm CT on KET
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Kentucky Tonight - S31 E4

  • Monday April 29, 2024 8:00 pm ET on KET
  • Monday April 29, 2024 7:00 pm CT on KET
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  • Wednesday May 1, 2024 1:00 am ET on KET
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Kentucky Tonight - S31 E5

  • Monday May 6, 2024 8:00 pm ET on KET
  • Monday May 6, 2024 7:00 pm CT on KET
  • Tuesday May 7, 2024 6:00 am ET on KETKY
  • Tuesday May 7, 2024 5:00 am CT on KETKY
  • Tuesday May 7, 2024 1:00 pm ET on KETKY
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  • Wednesday May 8, 2024 1:00 am ET on KET
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Legislative Session Recap - S31 E2

  • Tuesday April 16, 2024 6:00 am ET on KETKY
  • Tuesday April 16, 2024 5:00 am CT on KETKY
  • Monday April 15, 2024 8:00 pm ET on KET
  • Monday April 15, 2024 7:00 pm CT on KET

State Budget - S30 E44

  • Wednesday March 27, 2024 1:00 am ET on KET
  • Wednesday March 27, 2024 12:00 am CT on KET
  • Tuesday March 26, 2024 11:00 pm ET on KETKY
  • Tuesday March 26, 2024 10:00 pm CT on KETKY
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